Progressively Worsening FFB - DD1
Adam Baldwin
Member
I am a DD1 user using Rfactor 2. I have the issue described below occurring no matter the driver version.
When I first boot the game, FFB is fine. However, each time I press “drive” thereafter, the FFB worsens - with increasingly strong oscillation when touching curbs. Eventually, I hit drive and the wheel has a “rusty cog” feeling. This makes the wheel feel notchy and grainy, and the wheel is severely jolted over bumps or curbs. This cog feeling continues until I reboot the wheel base, then it’s back to normal
Two questions:
- Has anyone experienced a similar issue? Is there a known fix?
- Is there a way to reboot the wheel in game? It I turn the wheel on/off while Rfactor2 is running, I lose FFB entirely. I have to exit the game, restart the wheel base, then relaunch the game.
Thanks for any help!
Comments
Check this topic: https://forum.fanatec.com/discussion/1542/is-this-a-known-issue
Maybe it also solves your problem.
Thanks Pasqual. Interestingly, when I arrived at the cog feeling, turning off the SPR fixed it! This is strange given RF2 apparently does not utilize this...
However, even with the cog feeling gone, the worse FFB still remains until the wheel is rebooted. The best example I can give is alligator serrated curbing. After I start the wheel for the first time, I run over the curb and I can feel it but nothing violent happens. Later (building up to cog wheel) when I hit this same curb the wheel oscillates and is almost jarred from my hands.
With the new drivers, the "resistance cogs" are more clearly heard & felt. The cogs feel rusty now. I've recreated the issue in a video.
I have an open support ticket with Fanatec. They insist it's a non-hardware issue. I have tried this on different games, drivers, PCs, and USB ports. I have ensured the firmware is fully updated, for the wheel base, motor, and rim. I have completed the required calibrations.
I will say this - the issue is most prevalent in Rfactor 2. What is strange is this - in Rfactor 2 and the other sims I have this issue, according to Fanatec the "SPR and DPR have no effect." However, based on this issue, I am certain SPR and DPR do indeed have an impact. Why this interplay causes issues more over time, I'm not sure.
Furthermore, it appears that the same issue is described in the following threads on the discussion forms: example 1, example 2, example 3, example 4.
This is my issue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzTdZI0ulkE
Happens after two hours of continous use
I think this is the same bug, which I've been chasing this since 2016, and have literally spent over a hundred hours trying to solve it. I mostly use rFactor 2 and AMS. It has absolutely never happened in AMS, and for what little time I spent with PCars 2 it's never happened. It has also never happened in AC, but perhaps I just didn't used it long enough. Here's what I posted in the rfactor2 forum.
https://forum.studio-397.com/index.php?threads/fanatec-gt3rs-ffb-issue-in-next-session.61465/#post-974785
This issue came up in when I bought the CSW 2 (to my misfortune, a few months later Fanatec release the CSW 2.5, which had some additional settings to help the issue... namely the simulated wheel weight feature in the drift setting. I was hopeful for Fanalab to offer additional tuning, but as another slap in the face my wheel was not supported with the software. I offer no solution here, but i wanted too share that I was able to repeat the problem every time I use the NEXT SESSION in rFactor 2. It doesn't matter how long I've used the wheel. If I reboot the software, the problem goes away. I don't need to power down the wheel to solve the issue. To me the "Steering resistance coefficient" (and most likely the "Steering spring saturation") value gets thrown out the door when the NEXT SESSION is click. These settings are in the controller.json file in the player folder. BTW I'm 99.999999999% sure that the dampening and spring settings on the wheel ARE being read in rFactor 2. The default is just turned way down.
I just bought the DD1 and the problems is not as prevalent, or perhaps the additional settings has help hide the issue, but with certain highspeed curbs, I still get the SUPER saw tooth off-putting feel and intense clattering for a fraction of a second. I notice a similar feel and noise when the car catches air and impacts the ground (i.e. sausage curb impacts). I'm pretty sure it's associated with this value "Jolt magnitude": 1.5. I'm hoping with this info Fanatec can do something with their drivers to solve it. People spending this sort of money would find this totally unacceptable, not to mentioned it can't be good for the life of the motor.
In all fairness I do believe it's also an a bug with rFactor 2, perhaps even more so.
dd2 same issue, quite disappointing, hope this is sorted soon enough
Is there any way to restart a wheel base while a game is running without losing FFB?
I tried reloading the wheel profile in RF2 but a wheel base restart means no FFB. The in-game “reset FFB” button does nothing.
The issue is the quality of the FFB deteriorates with each run in qualifying, and I don’t have enough time to leave the server, restart the wheel, and restart the game.
Any tips would be appreciated.
Same for me. I mainly drive on RF2, so I can't say that it's the same on the other simulations, but I also have the same phenomenon.
At first everything is fine, every time I click on "drive" the rusty friction feeling gets stronger and stronger until I have to turn the steering wheel off and on again to solve the problem.
I mainly use the settings recommended on the forum page dedicated to RF2.
I used the 356 and 373 drivers without any improvement.
My steering wheel is a DD2 bought new in May/June 2020.
If anyone has any new information or solutions to communicate, I'm happy to do so because, as it stands, I haven't been able to really enjoy my DD2 since I got it, even regretting my old CSW2.5.
After a few tests mainly in RF2 (whose recommended settings indicate that SPR and DPR are not considered by the game), I can confirm that the problem no longer occurs when theses two parameters are set on OFF.
Probably there is a conflict with these settings and fanatec should modify the recommended settings page by indicating OFF on these values instead of 100.
I also don't understand why only some users are affected by this problem and not everyone. There has probably been a hardware revision on DD1/DD2 that makes some models more sensitive to these settings than others.
It would be interesting if a member of fanatec could read us and give us some explanations, as we users have done our share of work in discovering this malfunction.
sadly it is all silence and no help from fanatec....
Why this silence ? You know there is a problem and don't know how to solve it Fanatec ??
@Marcel Pfister ?
Hi everyone, first of all I would like to share some of my experience with this issue:
I have been running rFactor 2 for nearly 330 hours at this point, always with DPR disabled because I remember when first time tuning the FFB, I felt this grainy situation and realized DPR was causing that. At that time I just thought it was some incomaptibility with the sim or something.
Now its been quite some time I started to feel/pay attention to the FFB changing (worsening) overtime when racing for longer period, like changing tracks, cars, qualifiying and restarting offline races. At some point I wonder if it is my brain tricking. Then I realized I always have to increase a bit the INT and reduce FEI on the fly when these things happened. That has been the "normal" to me until I realize it is really an issue with Fanatec drivers and rfactor 2.
The culprit of my issue was last Saturday during the Iron Simracers event from Simracing-GP. I had a preset dialed in for the C8R GTE WITH DPR, not the Natural Damper as I used to do. After qualifying I clicked drive and as soon as the race starts the FFB is awfull to an unplayable level. I had to fix it on the fly. A detail: I use VR, so I had to lift the headset midway up while fixing the FFB while trying not to mess with the race...
And now to my point:
Today I have just reproduced this issue with both SPR and DPR disabled.
If you jump into a session, tweak your FFB (INT and FEI) to remove the grainy feeling), then race for a while and keep restarting the race, you shall notice the worsening over time, even without DPR and SPR.
What shall we do? Reseting rf2's FFB doesnt help. Restarting the DD2 in game kills the FFB until game is restarted. I am at loss right now. Any suggestions? Did someone manage to get these fixed? It seems like it is a LONG TIME issue, as reported by Von Do.
Anyone from FANATEC can enlighten us about this?
Had the same issue on my DD1. With every return to the garage force feedback got worse. Fixed it with putting NFR (natural friction) to zero. No need for further reboot. The worsening is gone.
Can confirm. Turning off Game Damper Effect Strength and Game Spring Spring Effect Strength done it for me. All good now.
I will attach my RF2 control file for the game too. I dialled out a lot of the sudden and harsh jolts too. Make sure when you are editing a profile to add this to, that it is the one specific for your wheelbase. DD1/DD2 etc etc as it has the 25nm peak setting there too.
"Force Feedback":{
"Brake effects on steer axis":0,
"Brake effects on steer axis#":"0 = Brake effects on brake axis, 1 = brake effects on steering axis.",
"Brake effects strength":10000,
"Brake effects strength#":"-10000 to +10000, applies to all brake effects (force, vibration, static spring, etc?)",
"Brake spring coefficient":0.3,
"Brake spring coefficient#":"Static spring effect rate (-1.0 to 1.0)",
"Brake spring saturation":1,
"Brake spring saturation#":"Static spring effect peak force (0.0 to 1.0)",
"Clutch effects on steer axis":0,
"Clutch effects on steer axis#":"0 = Clutch effects on clutch axis, 1 = brake effects on steering axis.",
"Clutch effects strength":10000,
"Clutch effects strength#":"-10000 to +10000, applies to all clutch effects (force, vibration, static spring, etc?)",
"Clutch spring coefficient":0.2,
"Clutch spring coefficient#":"Static spring effect rate (-1.0 to 1.0)",
"Clutch spring saturation":1,
"Clutch spring saturation#":"Static spring effect peak force (0.0 to 1.0)",
"G920_workaround":false,
"G920_workaround#":"Workaround for Logitech G920 firmware bugs ... may need to turn this off after firmware update if it gets fixed.",
"Gearbox effects on steer axis":0,
"Gearbox effects on steer axis#":"0 = Gearbox effects on gearbox 'axis', 1 = brake effects on steering axis.",
"Gearbox effects strength":10000,
"Gearbox effects strength#":"-10000 to +10000, applies to all gearbox effects (force, vibration, static spring, etc?)",
"Gearbox spring coefficient":0,
"Gearbox spring coefficient#":"Static spring effect rate (-1.0 to 1.0)",
"Gearbox spring saturation":1,
"Gearbox spring saturation#":"Static spring effect peak force (0.0 to 1.0)",
"Ignore controllers":0,
"Ignore controllers#":"Do not use FFB on: 1=controller1, 2=controller2, 4=controller3, 8=controller4 (or add values to ignore multiple controllers, for example 15 ignores all)",
"Jolt magnitude":0.5,
"Jolt magnitude#":"How strong jolts from other cars (or walls) are. Suggested Range: -2.0 to 2.0.",
"Off-road multiplier":0.3,
"Off-road multiplier#":"Temporary test variable to reduce force feedback strength off-road (0.0 = zero FFB, 1.0 = full FFB)",
"Other spring coefficient":0.2,
"Other spring coefficient#":"Static spring effect rate (-1.0 to 1.0) for any other FFB-capable controllers",
"Other spring saturation":1,
"Other spring saturation#":"Static spring effect peak force (0.0 to 1.0) for any other FFB-capable controllers",
"Rumble strip magnitude":0,
"Rumble strip magnitude#":"How strong the canned rumble strip rumble is. Range 0.0 to 1.0, 0.0 disables effect.",
"Rumble strip pull factor":1.5,
"Rumble strip pull factor#":"How strongly wheel pulls right\/left when running over a rumble strip. Suggested range: -1.5 to 1.5.",
"Rumble strip update thresh":0.05,
"Rumble strip update thresh#":"Amount of change required to update rumble strip effect (0.0 - 1.0)",
"Rumble strip wave type":0,
"Rumble strip wave type#":"Type of wave to use for vibe: 0=Sine, 1=Square, 2=Triangle, 3=Sawtooth up, 4=Sawtooth down.",
"Steering effects strength":10000,
"Steering effects strength#":"-10000 to +10000, applies to all steering effects (torque, resistance, static spring, jolt, etc.)",
"Steering resistance coefficient":0.1,
"Steering resistance coefficient#":"Coefficient to use for steering resistance. Range: -1.0 to 1.0",
"Steering resistance saturation":0.1,
"Steering resistance saturation#":"Saturation value to use for steering resistance. Range: 0 - 1.0",
"Steering resistance type":0,
"Steering resistance type#":"0=use damping, 1=use friction",
"Steering spring coefficient":0,
"Steering spring coefficient#":"Static spring effect rate (-1.0 to 1.0)",
"Steering spring saturation":0.1,
"Steering spring saturation#":"Static spring effect peak force (0.0 to 1.0)",
"Steering torque capability":25,
"Steering torque capability#":"The maximum torque capability of the wheel (in Nm, obviously)",
"Steering torque extrap blend":0,
"Steering torque extrap blend#":"Higher blends of extrapolated value allows driver to feel torque changes even when actual torque exceeds 'input max' (0.0=disables, 1.0=max)",
"Steering torque extrap time":0.015,
"Steering torque extrap time#":"Time in seconds to extrapolate steering torque based on current change (Range: 0.001 to 0.050. To disable, set 'blend' to 0.0)",
"Steering torque filter":1,
"Steering torque filter#":"Number of old samples to use to filter torque from vehicle's steering column (0-32, note that higher values increase effective latency)",
"Steering torque minimum":0,
"Steering torque minimum#":"Minimum torque to apply in either direction to overcome steering wheel's 'FFB deadzone' caused by friction",
"Steering torque per-vehicle mult":0.37,
"Steering torque per-vehicle mult#":"Per-vehicle steering column torque multiplier (this is a copy of the .CCH value)",
"Steering torque sensitivity":1,
"Steering torque sensitivity#":"Sensitivity curve applied to representable torques: 0.0=low 1.0=linear 2.0=high",
"Steering torque zero-speed mult":0.45,
"Steering torque zero-speed mult#":"Multiplier at zero speed to reduce unwanted oscillation from strong static aligning torque",
"Test_workaround":false,
"Test_workaround#":"Workaround for apparent driver CTD on release",
"Throttle effects on steer axis":0,
"Throttle effects on steer axis#":"0 = Throttle effects on throttle axis, 1 = throttle effects on steering axis.",
"Throttle effects strength":10000,
"Throttle effects strength#":"-10000 to +10000, applies to all throttle effects (force, vibration, static spring, etc?)",
"Throttle spring coefficient":0.1,
"Throttle spring coefficient#":"Static spring effect rate (-1.0 to 1.0)",
"Throttle spring saturation":1,
"Throttle spring saturation#":"Static spring effect peak force (0.0 to 1.0)",
"Type":1,
"Type#":"Type of force feedback: 0=off 1=wheel 2=joystick 3=rumble\/gamepad 4=custom",
"Use thread":false,
"Use thread#":"Use a separate thread to issue FFB commands which may block with some drivers"
},
Solution https://forum.studio-397.com/index.php?threads/ffb-becomes-grainy-after-session-change.66959/