Very happy to hear that current rims will stay compatible, this was my number one worry. After I learned of rim compatibility, now I know whose DD base I am getting
Not particularly DD related, but the only issue with Fanatec software I am facing is that it is not working very well if you re-plug Pedals/Base into different USB ports. (devices sometime get different Joystick # and that messes the games up). Also, system restart is required sometimes for correct initialization. I know that part of the issue is how OS enumerates joisticks, but I still hope to see some improvement here.
Otherwise, happy CSW 2.5/CSP3, CSS1.5 user here, and looking forward to your DD base.
I can only hope Fanatec keep the price competitive to the consumer/racer.
Fanatec have such a good opportunity to become the number one product line in the industry if they ensure a competitive price point they could wipe the floor with other makes
Keep the Direct drive low and make the profit on the peripherals would make sensible business strategy.
I cannot imagine the influx of orders for this, but I hope it goes well for Fanatec and wish them well with this exciting project on the horizon.
The current DD wheels are superior mostly because of its torque and speed. This actually makes a really big difference on how easy you can catch an oversteering car for example.
The subtle forces will be improved as well but up to a point where it is actually no longer realistic as you have some slack or loss in the steering system of a real car as well.
If you use a belt drive like on the CSW V2.5 you are already pretty close to DD but with a more powerful motor and a single drive V-belt system I am sure that you could reach better results than on a bad DD system with a notchy motor.
DD is great but it has to be done properly and it is not true that a belt system is by default inferior.
This is a very good point by Thomas. I fully agree with it, and with a good fast powerful motor, a belt-drive wheel might even surpass DD wheels to some degree in the tactile department to inherent damping in the form of the belts. It will most likely come close to real-life feel with lesser work on filters than is needed in direct drive wheels due to these belts.
I have at my disposal a V2 base which I will retrofit with such a do,union to test and proof the point or not. Will be a nice exercise though.
Catch you guys soon, I hope to visit you more often.
Beano
Hi Thomas,
I know we've discussed some of these during the expo, but was mostly related to the servos.
After extensive exposure to all types of controller/servo combinations over the past 3 years, including SS2 Bodnar, and a big variety of OSW setups, here is my recommendation on filters and a few other areas:
Peak-notch filter:
This one is to counter oscillatory behaviour around center of the wheel, when driving cars like the DW12 in iRacing. Here you need to be able to enter center frequency and attenuation. Very useful for those titles with lower ffb update rates
Damping, Friction and Inertia filters:
Very important to have these 3 to allow adding mechanical characteristics to the wheel. I find especially Damping and Inertia very important/handy.
Interpolation filter:
To scale up the low ffb update rate in iRacing, and significantly smooththe driving experience, this is a must - if you can have an interpolation freq>1khz, will help a lot even with wheels with lower encoders
Others:
Adjustble Bump-stops each side at the end of your wheel rotation degrees. Need to be able to set strength and slope angle
Encoders: I find, when used in conjunction with a very good interpolation filter, that encoders from 2,500PPR and up doing a great job, with the sweet spot at the 10,000PPR/40,000CPR level. A good quality encoder is a must. You can always provide update path from quadrature to SinCos and BiSS if your servo design allows for it.
I am currently testing 40k CPR incremental, 3.67M CPR SinCos and 4M CPR BiSS (22-bit) on my OSW Simucube setup. I also own a Bodnar SS2 to directly compare with, which itself has a 2M CPR Smart Feedback Device.
Servos:
We talked about this at the Simexpo during 2016, and I like your decision to do a customised range of servos for your solution. Their are many very good suitable (but expensive and over-the-top) servos available off the shelf, but they come with some sacrifices - not necessarily in performance, but in performance-per-dollar.
Doing your own, it would be very easy to have a series of servos with a low input voltage, perhaps 48-56VAC, but a high V/RPM range, in other words, it be wired that you can get 250-300RPM from a 48VAC input. Such a servo should also have a very good NM/A ratio, perhaps as high as 5:1, so that you will need around 5A AC only to get 25NM torque from it.
This is where customer servos, if specced and developed properly, can have a significant advantage over standard offerings. An additional advantage then is a significant reduced physical size, allowing and all-in-one solution.
During the last 3 years, the most bang-for-the-buck servos I have used must be the small and big Mige series, I am sure they will be very willing to work with companies such as yours. Despite being Chinese manufactured, they are good, robust, price-efficient and reliable.
If I had to design your controller, it will sport an AC drive output stage, significantly easier to developed than the DC alternative. It will have an onboard PSU, and output stage between 5-8A AC RMS.
Above just some of my thoughts, hopefully it comes in handy.
Talk soon again!
Cheers,
Beano
The market for wheel bases in general is finite. There is a larger market for a $150 wheelbase than there is for a $500 wheelbase and so on. When you get to $4,000 USD the market is SUPER finite. Fanatec did not build their consumer brand and a worldwide distribution network to sell a handful of DD units to professionals and the well-to-do (at least I don't think so). If I had to guess, the Fanatec DD product will be priced to compete with the Simxperience Accuforce that starts out at $900 for the base only. Happily, we don't have long to wait if the September reveal is still in the cards.
The market for wheel bases in general is finite. There is a larger market for a $150 wheelbase than there is for a $500 wheelbase and so on. When you get to $4,000 USD the market is SUPER finite. Fanatec did not build their consumer brand and a worldwide distribution network to sell a handful of DD units to professionals and the well-to-do (at least I don't think so). If I had to guess, the Fanatec DD product will be priced to compete with the Simxperience Accuforce that starts out at $900 for the base only. Happily, we don't have long to wait if the September reveal is still in the cards.
I wonder if it is still planned to show the DD wheel at the Simracing Expo mid september. Maybe behind closed doors, but i really hope to see some footage of it.
It would be nice
if we could have the option to use a real life steering
wheel, from the local tuner, without all those buttons & gizmo on the
steering wheel, something clean like a 36 - 38 cm of old 1989 porsche 911 in size, w201, e30, cadilac etc, and be able to easly switch to a smaller modern racing wheels which look like airplane board.
I am glad i waited for Fanatec DD...Smoothing with less notchy ffb, rim backwards compatibility, plug & play, competitive pricing, i only need the base etc etc. I am almost sold... If the base tier DD can hit that magic sweet spot under Accuforce & lowest osw costs i am in...Its a know brainer. Pluss we most likely will see loyalty price insensitives? Life is good.
Basically great news. But Thomas you wrote:
'The first generation will not be compatible to PS4.'
Again Sony who is making this restrictions?
So the PS4 community has to wait again. Please just tell me that there will be a PS4 DD wheel later in the future as well.
Thomas already stated that Sony found the V2(.5) is too expensive. That's why we got a CSL E base in stead. So they need to be more convinced of a product to be sold to their standards.
that's is not true In a recent conversation with GTPlanet regarding the wheel, Kazunori
sheds light on what was on everyone’s minds after first seeing the
images of the wheel emanating from The Copper Box Arena in London.
Namely, is it or is it not a direct drive wheel? Kazunori states this
wheel will be ‘Direct Drive’, which means the wheel is
directly attached to the steering shaft itself! Thrustmaster is doing
away with the usual belts and gears and replacing them with a direct
drive motor which will be employed by this new wheelbase.
In order of upcoming SimRacingExpo event at Nürburgring, and hoping to see and maybe even feel the DD... Who's up for a meeting. I'll be there with 2 or 3 other good friends, and I'd like to see who's gonna be there too?
Hi Don't seem to be able to get any info on your Direct drive wheel that you showed today at the Expo. My questions are, release date, price, and is there a preorder list I can go on. Thanks I wish success with this new exciting project. Lee
Hi Don't seem to be able to get any info on your Direct drive wheel that you showed today at the Expo. My questions are, release date, price, and is there a preorder list I can go on. Thanks I wish success with this new exciting project. Lee
You're not the only one who wants to know the answers. But like always, You won't hear or read anything About that until it's on the site.
Comments
your company chart looks great.
Fanatec will be showing there new DD at